Premiere, January 1995
SWEET 'N' JO by Larissa MacFarquhar.
Unafraid of being unhip, Winona Ryder forges a simon-pure 'Little
Women'
Winona Ryder is being perfectly adorable. Four words! she signals.
First word! Movie! She twinkles flirtatiously and bats her eyelashes,
laces her fingers and rests her chin on them like a Precious Moments figurine.
She poses for a moment -- then suddenly extends her arms and starts sashaying
around. "Shy!" sqeuaks Eva, the nine-year-old daughter of Susan Sarandon,
watching Ryder's every move. Wrong. "Dancer!" Wrong. "Pretty," guesses Sarandon.
More, bigger, Ryder signs. "Beautiful!" Sarandon cries, getting involved.
Close, so close, but shorter. "Beauty?" Sarandon guesses. "Beauty and
the Beast!" Eva yells, ecstatic. Yes! ** It's a lighthearted
interlude just after lunch on the Vancouver set of what will be the fourth movie
adaptation of , Louisa May Alcott's novel for girls. The set
is dominated by a New England house, surrounded by a complicated ersatz-nature
arrangement that enables the house photogenic inhabitants to enjoy autumn from
the kitchen window, winter from the parlor, and summer from around the corner.
Sarandon is playing Marmee, the matriarch of Little Women's fictional
March family. Ryder, naturally, is playing Jo -- the coolest March sister, the
tomboy, the heroine.
Denise De Novi, Little Women's producer, loves to talk about Ryder and
how fabulous she is in the movie. "Did you see Reality Bites?" Di Novi
asks. "I think that's the first film where you really see how adorable Winona
is. She's the most charming, funny, sweet person." Charming, funny, sweet -- and
cute as a bunny too. Not exactly the obvious choice to play Jo, who's prickly,
awkward, antisocial, and one of fiction's few pointedly unbeautiful heroines.
Well, this is, after all, a Christmas movie. And Ryder is, after all, an
actress.
Di Novi swears Ryder can handle the part. "She's actually more like Jo in
real life than any other character she's played," she claims. "Winona may be
little, but her personality is big." Ryder herself is positive she
doesn't look too pretty. "I hardly wore any makeup at all!" she says earnestly.
"And with my hair pulled back in a braid, I look very plain." Besides, Ryder's
brand of sweetness is also Little Women's: She's got a childlike,
just-milked-the-cows lilt that's perfect for the movie, if not for the part of
Jo. The occasional "fuck" notwithstanding, Ryder usually talks like Cindy Brady,
or the original Tiny Tim. "I've just had one of the greatest times I've ever had
making a movie," she syas with a happy sigh, "because I really truly love
everybody so much. I know it sounds cliche, but the girls really do feel like my
sisters, you know?"
There are four sisters in Little Women, plus one mother and a (mostly
absent) father. The six Marches are modeled on Louisa May Alcott's own family --
a fractious, eccentric, impoverished, pious group who lived in a number of
places up and down the Eastern seaboard during the middle of the 19th century.
Alcott's mother, Abby, came from an upper-class Boston family with a history of
involvement in the antislavery movement. Louisa's father, Bronson, was part of
the Emerson-Thoreau-Margaret Fuller transcendentalist circle in the 1830's and
'40s. He became famous for his Socratic teaching method, which aimed to draw
knowledge out of small children rather than put it in. Bronson's obsession with
child development led him to do some dubious things in the service of truth. He
allowed his daughter, Anna, when she was only a few months old, to twice put her
hand in the flame of an oil lamp: the first time to show her it would hurt, the
second to make sure she wouldn't forget. Later on, he convinced her that she
should love him all the more for punishing her since punishment made her good,
and he was so convincing that Anna took to beggingm "Father, punish! Father,
punish!"
Louisa, the second Alcott daughter, wrote Little Women in 1868 under
pressure from her publisher, who thought it would sell. "Mr N. wants a girls'
story... so I plod away, though I don't enjoy this sort of thing," she wrote in
her journal at the time. "Never liked girls or knew many except my sisters; but
our queer plays and experiences may prove interesting, though I doubt it." In
the novel, Jo, based on Louisa herself, changes from an evil-tempered, bookish,
loud, unladylike fifteen-year-old who wants deparately to be a famous author, to
a gentle, happy, married mother of two who still wants to write but has realized
that love is more important than ambition. The script brings the story up to
date by highlighting its PC elements and, when these do not exist, by borrowing
from the lives of the Alcotts. Robin Swicord, author of the screenplay,
certainly didn't want to reproduce the medieval politics of the 1933 George
Cukor Little Women (Katherine Hepburn's Jo is great, but she ends up
ironing) or the glorifious Technicolor banality of the 1949 version (June
Allyson, all smiles, plays Jo as Pollyanna). To Swicord's way of thinking,
Little Women is about successful single motherhood and female artists
coming of age, and so provides the ideal vehicle for a little covert validation.
"I hope that young girls emerge from the movie feeling stronger and less like
they live in a male-dominated world," she says. Not surprisingly, Swicord has
jettisoned the book's Christian ambivalence toward artistic achievement: In the
film, Jo's writing becomes central. (Swicord thinks the novel's ambivalence is
Louisa May Alcotts's unconscious apology for her father, widely considered a
failure and crackpot despite his famous friends.) And Swicord has thrown in many
of the Alcott causes, absent from the book, for good political measure: the
temperance and women's movemnets; the thwarted attempt to desegregate Bronson's
school; even transcedentalism.
This last item is noteworthy because it is the utopian connection that makes
Ryder not quite so unlikely a choice to play Jo as she would seem. As a kid,
Ryder spent four years living on an electricity-free commune in Northern
California that was in some respects a hippie version of Brook Farm, the
trascendentalist settlement that Bronson Alcott helped found. She was raised,
Alcott-style, to be free from convention and to believe, as Ryder puts it, that
"whatever you do is okay unless you hurt somebody else." Ryder herself is unsure
whether this or any other real-life likeness to Alcott or Jo helped her with the
part. Mimesis is, of course, such a complicated business. "I've tried to have
this conversation with other actors," she says. "Are we adding our own
personalities to the characters or are we creating different personalities?
Acting is so strange."
The commune experience has come in handy, though, in scenes involving
candles. Ryder is accustomed to them, but noncommunnard Claire Danes was not,
and managed to set her hair onfire. The crew, used to girly high spirits on the
set, thought Danes's screams weren't serious and did nothing. Eventually Ryder
leaped on top of the actress and put the fire out. "I guess Claire didn't
realize that you have to hold candles away from your head," Ryder says.
Ryder was snagged for Little Women by Denise Di Novi; the two worked
together on Heathers and Edward Scissorhands. Di Novi got involved
with the movie at the behest of Amy Pascal, then an executive vice-president of
production at Columbia. Pascal rang up Di Novi and asked if she'd be interested
in working on the project; Di Novi said she would die to. "And I called Winona."
Di Novi recalls, "because we had talked about how much we both loved the book on
the set of Heathers, and I said, 'You won't believe this but we can do
Little Women!' And of course she jumped and said she'd love to do it."
Di Novi is sitting in the sparsely furnished office from which she is running
the movie. The room's only design element is a shelf-long row of Evian bottles.
As she talks, Di Novi reaches for one of these and, Player-like, uses it
to water a bunch of flowers. "I found Little Women a very comforting book
as a kid," Di Novi says, "because Jo wasn't like all those other girl heroines
-- really pretty and popular and everything. I didn't feel inadequate when I
read about Jo. I feel bad for teenagers nowadays, reading Danille Steele and
Judth Krantz novels -- I've read a couple of then and they make me feel like a
shlump."
Di Novi is anxious to convey that Little Women is still rather
radical, even in the '90s. "It's so important that Jo doesn't marry Laurie, the
beautiful rich guy," she says. "I don't want to sound like a spoilsport, but I
do think on a deep psychic level it's very harmful for both men and women to
think there's this perfect 10 out there for them." No, she concedes, Gabriel
Byrne, who player Professor Bhaer -- the plain, donnish, German whom Jo
does marry -- is not exactly Frankenstein's monster. "I don't think you
have to marry an ugly guy to be a feminist or something," she begins slowly,
venturing with care into this potential contradiction. "But Jo chooses her soul
mate based on an intellectual, emotional, connection, not superficial, romantic,
love-at-first-sight things or sexual chemistry. Anyway, Gabriel Byrne is
handsome, but he's not Richard Gere. He's older, and kind of slobby --
not your traditional hero."
Looking for an actress to play Marmee, Di Novi decided she wanted someone
"earthy and warm and sensual" -- and who better than Susan Sarandon? Like Ryder,
Sarandon can identify with an aspect of the Alcott family: not the commune
aspect, but the religious-ethical one. Sarandon grew up in a strict Catholic
family, the eldest of nine, and as a child aspired to a career as a saint. She
is famously political, and at the 1993 Academy Awards she took the opportunity
to make a speech about the plight of AIDS-infected Haitian refugee that was a
real downer and annoyed a lot of people and was exactly what Marmee or
Bronson Alcott would have said under similar circumstances. Sarandon is quick to
point out, however, that there is all the difference in the world between
Catholics and transcendentalists. "The Catholic Church is so misogynist, and
about punishing yourself and original sin and all those doctrines that make you
apologize from the day you're born," she says. "The Alcotts were closer to being
Quakers, and the Quaker philosophy is community service and being a good
person."
Sarandon just can't get over how great Marmee is, and what a wonderful model
she makes for mothers today. So is Marmee perfect? This stops Sarandon for a
second, presumably because she knows perfect is bad. "I hope she's not perfect,
or she would be so unreal," she says. "I'm sure there's lots of thing wrong with
her. She's a woman in struggle, as every real person is." Is there anything
about Marmee she does not identify with? "The corset and the buttpad and the
hairdo I definitely don't," Sarandon says grimly. "And I don't think Marmee
cared what people thought of her. Also, she put up with a lot more from her
husband than I would have. Under a philosophical banner, he was pretty abusive.
He practically starve and froze those girls to death."
Corsets, buttpads, abusive husbands... Little Women --
as-feminist-morality-tale was definitely there to be made, but Gillian
Armstrong, the movie's director, didn't want to make it. Unexpectedly, the
Australian director of My Brilliant Career (the story of a woman who
flees romance to follow her muse) and the Smokes and Lollies documnetary
series (which follows a group of girls through adolescence and early adulthood)
hates the idea that she might be thought of as a woman filmmaker. "I consider
myself a film director and an artist," Armstrong says, annoyed by the suggestion
that Little Women might be a feminist movie. "Of course I believe in
women's rights, and of course I wouldn't do a film that was sexist, but that
doesn't mean I want to make commercials for the women's movement. Besides, I've
always tought that the best way to carry a message is with a bit of
entertainment."
The bit of entertainment Armstrong has been trying for is comedy. "The thing
we're stressing is the humor," she says. "I hope it's not hokey." This is a tall
order. Little Women the Chrsitmas movies... well, one can only imagine.
"I don't think there are a lot of belly laughs," Sarandon says
diplomatically, "but Marmee has a certain sense of irony."
"The humor is more in the expressions on our faces," Ryder explains when
asked the same question. "The movie is not that kind of roll-around-laughing
funny, but it's really real."
Making Little Women has been something pf an experiment for Armstrong
-- the last time she worked in Hollywood the experience was a disaster: Her
film, Fires Within was recut by MGM despite her protests, to the point at
which she no longer fely any connection to it, and then was barely released. But
Armstrong seems to be ready to forgive and get paid American wages again. "It's
the old Hollywood story," she says philosophically. "It's part of the game: They
put up the money and then they tell the director who's made them a $100 million
success that she doesn't have the final cut. It's the luck of the draw, really."
This time, just to be safe, Armstrong took the footage home and edited it in
Australia. And, according to Ryder at least, it shows. "Gillian is such a great
director," Ryder says. "She's got a real point of view I thinl Little
Women is going to be a classic movie because it's really heavy and really
intelligent and in a way it's a real art movie too -- like it'll appeal to the
people who drink cappuccinos in the lobby. you know?"
And if it doesn't, and the My Brilliant Career crowd decides to snub
Armstrong's latest pregeny, there's still the sentimental masses, in search of
warmed cockles and jerked tears, to make the movie a success. "In these times,"
Ryder says, "when everything's so hip, this movie is so pure. It's beautiful.
It's inspiring. It's about people, it's about individuals, it's about women's
rights, it's a great love story -- all the things we label corny, but they're
really not." Ryder pauses, and sighs at the very thought of it. "It's the knid
of movie," she says finally, "that makes you want to call your mom."
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Vogue, December 1996
Winona On a Role by John Powers
Winona Ryder tells John Powers she's tired of being America's favorite
ingenue. In her chilling performance in this month's The Crucible,
there's nothing sweet about her. Photographed by Steven Meisel."This car
makes me nervous," says Winona Ryder, pulling into heavy traffic. We're heading
to lunch in a black Mercedes that, befitting a young woman famously raised on a
cornmune, she seems slightly embarrassed about owning. Although she's had it
only a few weeks, the passenger side is already dented.
Ryder likes to talk. "I'm a rambler," she admits wryly, and as we cruise
toward Wilshire Boulevard, her conversation leapfrogs from topic to topic. How
she "worships" Gwyneth Paltrow. How Al Pacino wooed her for Looking for
Richard (she does a hilarious Godfather rasp). How she hopes to make
a sequel to Heathers -- "because there are still Heathers everywhere."
Chatting away, she drives like she's auditioning for the remake of Annie
Hall. Turning left, she cuts off a driver who begins leaning on his horn.
"That's so-o unfair," Ryder moans. "I didn't do anything wrong. Unsettled by his
furious honking, she promptly runs a red light. Moments later her cellular phone
rings, and she can't figure out where it is - in a panic, she starts swatting at
the dashboard as if she's trying to kill a bee. When we finally reach the safe
haven of valet parking, only slightly frazzled by the trip, she gives me a
dazzling grin: "We made it."
Ever since 1989's Heathers, Ryder has had a curious pull on
moviegoers: She's glamorous enough to be an ideal, yet ordinary enough to seem
within reach. As the brainy ingenue with a streak of rebellion, the 25-year-old
actress has also become a nineties touchstone. There's a Bay Area punk-pop band
called the Wynona Riders. In Primary Colors, a James Carvilielike politico calls
his sexy young campaign workers "Winonas." Her fans have created more than eight
different Winona Web sites on the Internet, one devoted to answering frequently
asked questions about her family, her films, and the possibility of downloading
dirty pictures. (She winces. "I don't do nudity ever")
Noni, as friends call her, is one of Hollywood's most literate young stars,
and Quentin Tarantino aside, the one most in love with the movies. "I see
everything," she says - and means it. She's a flurry of enthusiasms. In the
course of a brief conversation, she'll do a ten-minute riff on Bastard Out of
Carolina, discuss Judy Davis's "amazmg" performance in a 'dreadful" movie
she saw on cable at 4:00 A.M., and rave up Bandit Queen, an Indian film
about a downtrodden village girl who becomes a leader of the dispossessed. Given
the least prompting, she'll quote whole scenes from Albert Brooks's Modern
Romance, which she and her family watch over and over.
Today, she's ecstatic about her new film, The Crucible, an adaptation
of Arthur Miller's play about mass hysteria (and McCarthyism) set during the
Salem witch trials of 1692. Ryder stars as Abigail Williams, a young Puritan
woman who's spurned by her married lover (Daniel Day-Lewis) and begins accusing
innocent people of sorcery. For the first time, Ryder plays the bad guy. And she
does it with such demonic, hollow-eyed fierceness that many in Hollywood are
already taking an Oscar nomination for granted. The Crucible could do for
Ryder what Fatal Attraction did for Glenn Close: get her out of the
nice-girl ghetto.
Ryder is eager for such a litberation, both on-screen and off-.
"When I was younger," she says, "every time I'd open my mouth on the set,
people would go, 'Isn't that cute? Winona has her littie ideas. Isn't that
cute?' Well, I'm not the youngest person on the set anymore."
The Crucible is only one step in Ryder's ambitious plan to be a
grown-up on film. In Alien: Resurrection, she'll try something even more
audacious -- playing an action hero. With her hair cropped short for the film,
she stili looks more like the eternal waif than the toughest chick in outer
space.
Ryder's not daunted. Slim as filigree, she's gone on a high-powered exercise
regimen to prepare for slaughtering space monsters alongside Sigourney Weaver,
who is reprising the character of Ripley. "I'm training six hours a day, six
days a week," Ryder says, "because I don't want to be the only one gasping on
the starship. It's exhausting, but it also helps me to vent - especially the
martial-arts stuff. My instructor says I'm a natural." She gives a proud smile.
"It's all very technical, you know. Block, jab,jab, hook, jab, jab, block -
pow! I love it. "When they first mentioned doing the movie, I almost
jumped out of my seat," she says. "You see, my whole family is obsessed with
Alien. My brother Jubal runs a comicbook store, and one wall is covered
with Alien paraphernalia. I must have been about nine when I saw the
original because we were still living on the commune. And I wanted to be Ripley.
She was the first woman action hero, and she's still one of the greatest women's
roles. I had to do it."
Although not yet completely comfortable with starring in a special-effects
extravaganza - "I don't think of it as an action movie," she says hopefuly -
Ryder is thrilled to have landed the role. Having spent years playing sedentary
young women who don't know their own hearts, she's relishing the chance to cut
loose.
She fixes me with those dark eyes. "Playing cute and confused doesn't
interest me anymore," she says. "I wanted to be an actress ever since I was a
girl." If this sounds strange, it's because she became an actress when she was a
girl. At thirteen, she went straight from a San Francisco acting class t o a
role in the Hollywood film Lucas. Within five years - the time it took to
make Beetlejuice, Heathers, and Edward Scissorhands - she'd become the
leading actress of her generation. While such peers as Julia Roberts have been
steamrollered by their stardom, Ryder has used her clout to work with the best
filmmakers.
Ryder possesses a natural winsomeness, a virtue that can easily turn wan in
films (like Reality Bites) that rely on it too much. She's best when her
characters have a few sharp edges. Her most memorable roles, in Heathers
and The Age of Innocence, are sneakily jagged, showcasing her ability to
perform on more than one level. Heathers's Veronica must juggle two
distinct kinds of madness - a Darwinian high school hierarchy that glorifies
cheerleaders and a boyfriend who attacks it with gleeful murder. Similarly, May
Welland in The Age of Innocence must wear the placid veneer of the
well-bred social butterfly while revealing, in the quietly lethal climax with
her husband, a territorial sense worthy of a barracuda.
In The Crucible Ryder reachs a new level of emotional rawness. As the
hysterical Abigail WIlliams, bent on avenging her wronged innocence, she
bristles with the fury of one goaded by the demons of eroticism and madness.
("People keep saying Abigail's a bitch," grumbles Ryder, irked that anyone would
view the character so shallowly. "But she's also a victim. I feel for her.")
It's her most adult performance - and her most sexual.
Some of that role's sexual charge carries over into her description of acting
with Daniel Day-Lewis.
"I'm simply besotted with him," she says, eyes glittering, her voice ardent.
"He's so good he forces you to give the best performance. You want to please
him. It's almost like a supernatural experience: Your mind cannot leave a scene
when you're with him. It's like he has you by the throat, and you give
everything to him because he deserves it."
Of course, succeeding as a movie star has as much to do with good instincts
as it does with acting.
"Winona's having such a good career," says The Crucible's director,
Nicholas Hytner, "because she never worries about her career. She does what
interests her rather than what looks like just another step on the Hollywood
chessboard."
"When I was offered Heathers," she remembers, "my agent at the time
got on her knees, literally, and sald, 'Please don't do this movie. I promise
you if you do this movie you will never work again.'
"I said, 'I'm sorry, but I'm gonna do it, and I don't care if it ever comes
out.' And I never looked back." She gives a tiny glint of self-satisfaction,
then adds, "I was fifteen-and-a-half at the time."
But being a teenage movie star is not without its costs. Ryder pulled out of
The Godfather, Part III at the last minute, blaming a "respiratory
infection" that many thought a pretext for self-indulgence or nervous collapse.
A few years later, during her long breakup from Johnny Depp (and his WINONA
FOREVER tattoo), she suffered through what she calls "a very dark time." She
smoked heavily, bit her nails to the nub. She suffered grievous bouts of
insomnia, followed by a reliance on the sleeping pills prescribed to battle it.
When Ryder is in a good mood, it's easy to forget her abiding sense of
melancholy. Her obsessions run to the grim. She devours movies about child abuse
and has optioned books like Susanna Kaysen's madhouse memoir, Girl
Interrupted.
At her suggestion, we meet one morning at L.A.'s Museum of Tolerance, which
is filled with genocide exhibitions and interactive warnings against bigotry.
"I lost a lot of relatives in the Holocaust," she says simply, and her
eyelids do that little dance they do whenever she's dealing with an unsettling
subject. "What scares me the most about it is the separation. Even more than the
deaths, it's families being separated."
Ryder feels peculiarly at home in places like this, but today a tour group
begins demanding autographs. She politely signs and signs - who could turn down
anyone in a museum devoted to tolerance? - but eventually the fans' rude
insistence forces us to flee.
"Was I mean?" she asks in the elevator. "I was trying to be nice, but I feel
like I was so-o mean.
There's no reassuring her.
"I'm insecure about everything," she says, laughing even about worrying too
much. "I get this way when I'm not working. I have too much time to think about
myself."
Such self-absorption is hardly surprising: Her entire adult life has been
spent answering (and dodging) questions about her personal life - about her long
relationships with Johnny Depp ("First love is amazing and devastating" is her
single, oblique comment) and Dave Pirner of Soul Asylum. Although they recently
split, she calls Pirner "the best person I've ever met.
"Being with Johnny Depp broke me in. We couldn't go a week without reading
something that either wasn't true or was only half true, or was taken out of
context. I wouldn't want to go through that again. Looking back, I can see that
it did affect our relationship. I was at an age when I was really insecure." She
sips her Evian. "But in retrospect, I'm grateful for the experience. By the time
I was 21, nothing could faze me."
Maybe not, but a few days later, when talk of a romance with the The
X-Files's David Duchovny spread from the tabloids to TV Guide, Ryder quickly
issued a public denial.
"Somehow the rumor got started," she tells me over the phone, "and it was
like a hurricane hit. I just wanted to nip it in the bud. We went out a few
times, but that's all there is. I'm not involved with anyone. Period."
"Noni's a very nice person," says a young actress who knows her. "But it has
to have been hard for her because she's never had a normal life. Like when
somebody suggests something ordinary, like 'Let's have a barbecue,' she gets
kind of excited because for her that's something really exotic. If it wasn't for
having a cool family, she'd probably have gone crazy by now."
Because Ryder's parents, Michael and Cindy Horowitz, were deeply involved in
the counterculture, much has been written of her "hippie" upbringing. But these
days, the Horowitz kids appear to lead strikingly conservative lives - "Round
people have square babies," Ryder jokes. She talks constantly about her parents
and siblings (sister Sunyata, brothers Jubal and Yuri). They are her refuge, her
balm. She bought a house in San Francisco partly because her lower Manhattan
apartment was too far from Petaluma, where her parents live.
Ryder says she'd like a family of her own someday, but at the moment she's
too busy making movies and enjoying the perks ofstardorM - which include scoring
the best seats when her favorite rocker, Paul Westerberg, plays the Troubadour,
and hanging out with Gwyneth, Mira, and Ashley at last fall's big New York City
bash for Giorgio Armani.
Although she likes to play down her obvious interest in fashion, Ryder is
widely admired in Hollywood for her old-style sense of glamour; people still
hail the triumphant audacity of the vintage fringed dress she wore to the 1994
Academy Awards.
"Normally, I dress like this, " she says, gesturing down at the black
cutoffs and sleeveless T-Shirt that display the merest hint of the new
musculature produced by all those hours in the gym. "But when I go out, I like
real simpIe, beautiful clothes - almost boyish." These days she's particularly
fond of Prada, Anna Molinari, and Jil Sanden.
The next afternoon, we're sitting in Ryder's Beverly Hills house, a small
Spanish number whose downstairs is dominated by a big-screen TV and a poster of
Gena Rowlands in A Woman Under the Influence. It's 45 minutes until her
next six-hour stint at the gym, and she's talking about identity. When she was
younger, she would often be ambushed by pain and depression because, she says,
"I didn't know who I was when I wasn't acting." But entering her second decade
as a screen actress, Ryder has a much stronger idea of herself. She feels she
took another step forward earlier this year in dealing with the death of her
godfather Timothy Leary.
"I was with Tim when he died," she says, her voice growing soft. "He was
smiling, and after he died, they couldn't push his smile down. You know, I saw
him a lot in the last few weeks of his life, and got to hold his body, which was
an amazing experience and not as morbid as I anticipated. Watching him made me
not so afraid of death.
"I spoke at the funeral. I quoted F. Scott Fitzgerald on 'epic grandeur,'
which I knew Tim would like. Afterward, people kept saying to me, 'We've never
heard you talk outside of a movie before.' And they were right. I was using my
own words for once. I was talking as myself, as me. And I liked it," she
says. "I liked it."
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